View Full Version : shal I hold my breath
live_wire
04-13-2002, 04:29
I am a 24 y/o Firefighter -EMT from Nj. i was looking to get into law enforcement somewhere, probably down south. A relative is a sheriff down there. The problem is I used to smoke Pot. I never sold it to kids or anything. I'd get it for myself and a few close friends for our own use. NOT DISTRIBUTION!. I last smoked in Jan. To this day I know why I started but even more importantly I know Why I quit. I wanted to be a Cop. that and what good did it di me. Makes ya paranoid and hungry, then when i ate I got a belly ache. It is most defenitily behind me. Pot was all I ever did. Now i dont smoke, hardly drink, and NO drugs. i am now a Fire Instructor, EMT instructor, and CPR instructor. I know with this relatives help I stand a really good chance but I dont want to screw him if I apply and dont get hired for this, but at the same time this is a great oppertunity. I dont want some immature thing in my past to keep me from this career goal either. I have a friend that went to vegas PD and he said he lied about his use so he wouldnt ge tcut and now hes on. Again I dont want to lose it all cause I lied. Wouldnt a PD respect my honesty, or DQ me for it. any guidance would be welcomed!:confused:
Kahuna5150
04-13-2002, 05:48
Originally posted by live_wire
I am a 24 y/o Firefighter -EMT from Nj....The problem is I used to smoke Pot......I last smoked in Jan. To this day I know why I started but even more importantly I know Why I quit. I wanted to be a Cop......Again I dont want to lose it all cause I lied. Wouldnt a PD respect my honesty, or DQ me for it. any guidance would be welcomed!:confused:
You want honesty so here it is... You are 24 and you just stopped using marijuana in Jan. This is a *BIG* problem. I assume you have been smoking for a *LONG* time to have just quit in Jan and being that you're already 24. You also write that you are currently a Firefighter and EMT from NJ. I am assuming (again) that you work for some gov. agency (a city, county, state, etc). This is another *HUGE* red flag. You're in a position of public trust working as a sworn firefighter for the state, county, or city and you're using marijuana.
You say you quit because you wanted to be a cop. What happens if you don't get hired? Will you go back to smoking once you find out you don't have a chance? I respect the fact you don't want to lie, but I hope it is because you don't feel it is right not because you're worried about loosing a job you might get because of you lie later on.
If you were applying to my department here in CA or any other for that matter you will most certainly be DQ'd with the information you just provided. I don't know what other departments might say, but here in CA you're a done deal. If you have a relative who is the Sheriff and you have connections and decide to lie, then yes maybe you will slip through. Of course if you do get hired by not being honest, eventually this information will probably come out and you'll be terminated.
Unfortunately you made some bad choices... I'm glad you're done with marijuana now, but I think the damage is done.
Kahuna
WILawman
04-13-2002, 22:20
I am suprised that you are in the position (firefighter-emt) of public trust and still smoking MJ. Not to be too blunt, but I would not hire you nor would I think any department would either.
As Kahuna5150 said, the damage is done.
K9 Police
04-13-2002, 22:40
I have a question live_wire, and if it is too personal you don't have to answer. How long have you used MJ and how often? From the SOUND of your post it seems like you have been using it for a long time. I agree with the posters, especially using while being in a public trust position.
K9
live_wire
04-15-2002, 15:26
What I wrote earlier may need to be clarified for those close minded. First I hadnt been smoking long at all. or for a long time. I came across somethings while cleaning and out of a one nights curiosity and reminder I rememberd why i didnt continue with the habbit. something done for a couple of months a few years ago shouldnt be held against me. people make mistakes. I will have you klnow though I have made it to my position and reputation foir being DAMN good at what I do. I am also an Instructor. For a hippie pot head that you assume I am I have busted my but to be where I am at. I am 25 and have beeten out people with more years. I earn my keep and I keep others alive. I did something back at the end of highschool for a bit , then stopped. I didn know what I wanted to be or what I had to do to get there. When I learned that I set pace and exceeded that time and time again. In a highly competative field I have surpassed the challenges laid before me. I did this on my own. No drugs. No Support. No shame. I think between the ages of 17 and 27 a Person learns some of the most significant life lessons. I learned mine, but the fact I put certain experiences behind me and came as far as I have I deserve no more but no less crewdit than the next guy. Cops, Firefighters, Medics are all human. I never lit a joint on the rig. Hell I spent all those years when I was a kid growing in the culture condemming it. I wanted to know before I preached. I learned, and am now beyond it. If people out there will judge me off of things i did at 18 and overlook what I am now, Then they will be the ones truly losing out. Atleast I can say I have been there. you learn more from that then a pamphlet anytime!!!:bounce: :bounce:
K9 Police
04-15-2002, 20:23
I agree with Gonzos post.
The only thing I have to add is that when you ask for the opinion of posters, they are going to do just that...give their honest and true opinon. Otherwise everyone on the board would be replying "Yeah sounds like you have a chance, go for it." If you don't want to hear the hard and downright honest truth from other people, then don't ask for their opinion.
Just my .02
K9
Kahuna5150
04-15-2002, 23:42
Originally posted by live_wire
What I wrote earlier may need to be clarified for those close minded. First I hadnt been smoking long at all. or for a long time. I came across somethings while cleaning and out of a one nights curiosity and reminder I rememberd why i didnt continue with the habbit. something done for a couple of months a few years ago shouldnt be held against me....I never lit a joint on the rig. Hell I spent all those years when I was a kid growing in the culture condemming it. I wanted to know before I preached. I learned, and am now beyond it. If people out there will judge me off of things i did at 18 and overlook what I am now, Then they will be the ones truly losing out. Atleast I can say I have been there. you learn more from that then a pamphlet anytime!!!
Well I think Gonzo pretty much covered it, but I'll add my .02 again... Here's the biggest problem for us "close minded" people (and if that's your definition of us then the majority of people doing the hiring for police positions are far more closed minded than anyone here)... If I am to read into what you're saying, you used to smoke after being 18, you stopped, and then while cleaning out some stuff from somewhere you came across some MJ and decided to smoke it again (your first post made it sound as though this last time was *VERY* recent). Now you are *AGAIN* reminded why you don't smoke now... Your excuse for wanting to have tried the MJ before you preached against it also won't hold water. Again as Gonzo pointed out, new FBI agents don't go out and rob banks so they know what it's like from the inside before they start enforcing the law against it...
"Something done for a couple of months a few years ago shouldn't be held against me..." Your opinion (and you are entitled to have it), but where is the line drawn? MJ use after being hired as a firefighter for a government agency? That seems pretty over the line to me. Again we're not talking about some dumb college kid smoking some MJ a few times. We're talking about a FIREFIGHTER (City, State, County Employee right? Or are you in a private contracted fire department?) who breaks the law after assuming his official office.
Perhaps those that judge you will be loosing out on a potentially stellar officer, but I personally think all of the information of what type of firefighter you are is hurting you more than anything. I mean if you were some young screw up firefighter and you messed up, maybe someday you could show you have grown and the maturity is now there and some things could be explained or overlooked based on immaturity. By your own definition you're a shining star as a firefighter and you're so with it you're beating out most of the competition because you're so competent. If you truly are an instructor and so skilled, it will be impossible to chalk these bad mistakes up to immaturity. As an example, a young Marine in boot camp can screw up pretty severely and still get by and learn from the mistakes. Take a seasoned Drill Instructor and have them screw up in the exact same way and I can pretty much assure you his career is over. Different standards for where you are in life.
It sounds to me you are exactly where you should be. You are doing a great job as a firefighter and why press your luck and risk a bad background by a law enforcement agency based on your mistakes...
Kahuna
You've only achieved your status at your current job because they didn't know what you were up to when you were not at work. I'm sure if you told your supervisor "Hey I got stoned last weekend" you wouldn't be where you are today.
You could lie and hope to get through the background and you might make it. (I'd hope not) The likelihood that you'd get found out would be pretty good and you would never work in law enforcement after that. If the investigator was halfway decent he'd let your supervisor know too.
You can also find out what the time since last usage limits are for the department you want to work for and wait until then to apply.
It makes no sense to chime in with a long winded opinion now. Others did a great job already. I would only be further dismembering the carcus. But this time i'm a go out of character and play the morale booster, pat on your back, you can do it, personality.
Live wire don't let them or anyone tell you what you can, or can not do. Only you know how much you did. And only you know what's in your heart. And besides it was only a little MJ. There are alot of other hard durgs that you stayed away from. That proves you are not a druggie. You just make a mistake. And like you said we are all human. I say give it a go live_wire.
Sarcasm off
You last smoked MJ in Jan. Most departments have at least a 2 year limit of being Pot free. Plus you got high as a kyte while you were in a position of public trust. Didn’t your conscience beat on you like a jackhammer? If it did or didn’t, either way that’s troubling I don't know what type of department would ever hire you KNOWING that.
oh yeah. To answer your original question. NOPE, I wouldn't
No, BECAUSE IT IS A CRIME!!!
I need not say more....maybe as a youth who was experimenting you could get away with it, but you are passed that now. I personally have no tolerance for week minded people who come up with excuses for there acts. I Never did drugs.....am I a Saint? Hell no....
Sorry, to all...I get riled up on drug questions...
JH
I guess you should be lucky that they never piss tested you!! The good old fashion whiz quiz probally would have cost you your job!!! I am sure you are good at what you do BUT I doubt that any BI would approve your MJ usage...If law enforcement is something you honestly want to do then go for it, you never know til you try! Take care
VooDoo:D
live_wire
04-17-2002, 14:52
For what its worth, this is not bank robbing. If you can truly eqate the two then you need and enima and have to loosen up. Of all the crimes out there you should really think of the platform you enforce. MJ is not coke, opium. rape, murder. carjacking. I refuse to defend what I did any further. I asked a question to clarify a discision for the future as whether or not to be honest and possibly taint the job of another, or lie and not be found. I thank those that responded and found a way to remain objective. as a "position of trust" You have fare more boozers that are on the job, than MJ users. From experienced professional medical opinions that I have heard over time, those people are far more volitile. Their mood swing can bouce from a level of lethargic calm to violent rampages. A person who smoke a few puffs on his own time, off duty is now considered a criminal. Yes maybe my issue should be more whether or not it shoould be legalized. Lets all drink ourselves into liver failure and domestic violences and become drunk drivers but never ever puff a joint. for now you are the worst criminal.hhhhhhmmmmmmmmmmmm
K9 Police
04-17-2002, 15:46
The name of the game is "law enforcement".
You continually broke the law, especially doing drugs. In my eyes, MJ is not better or worse than the other type of drugs you mentioned. Last time I checked, it is legal to drink over 21. As for drunk driving, I am totally against this as well. As sure are most departments and reasons for DQing those with DWI convictions.
As Gonzo said, you will justify it to no avail. No one is going to be able to convince you until the department says "no thanks".
K9
live-wire, To give you an honest opinion, I think it would be near impossible for you to get a job in LE right now. It's pointless to debate whether MJ is better or worse than alcohol or other drugs. That fact remains that you did it recently and in a position of public trust. If you go in for an interview ( if you get that far) you will most certainly be sent packing. My advice, if you really want this, is to put plenty of time between last usage and applying. You need to show that you have grown up. That will be a little harder to do since you did it so recently and at that age. You never know what can happen. But, you need to make yourself the best candidate possible. You do need to admit that it was a mistake and you were wrong. Can you imagine going in to your background interview and saying "hey, for what it's worth, it's not bank robbing." I think we all would have been laughed out of the interview room if we said that. Anyway, good luck.
Sigy:destroy:
I'm not going to make this a long winded post; however, I'd just like to add a few additional thoughts..... On the job, I see on a daily basis how drugs (including alcohol) ruin peoples lives, directly and indirectly; I could make this a long post on this point alone, but I won't.. Accordingly, I have a low tolerence for illegal drug users and no tolerence for drug dealers... Public servants are especially held to a higher standard and rightfully so... Sorry, but thats the way I feel... Yes, alcohol is a problem, but it's LEGAL. Last I checked, MJ is not.....
Gonzo, great post, my sentiments exactly...
I've never understood why people need an illegal substance to get high on..... I guess something is lacking in their life, or maybe they just can't cope... The other night I was catfishing, doing rather well, and I thought to myself that it don't get much better than this..... I thank the lord daily, count my blessings, and get high on life, god bless............
;)
K9 Police
04-17-2002, 22:36
Im sorry, I just had to post. ACO073, that is one excellent post, especially your last paragraph.
"thank the lord daily, count my blessings, and get high on life"
I will toast to that.
K9
live-wire: You truly represent the slime that most of us see every day...and place our lives on the line to defend against. Your little MJ bouts are not defendable, so you resort to childish posts and illogical statements about drinking, crime, etc. What you do is illegal and what you chose to support is illegal.
People like you give public service employees a bad name...I only would hope your organization becomes more enlightened and adopts drug testing, so you can make noises on the outside...looking in.
Or better yet, why not resign and become a MJ avocate? Or is the closet the better place to be?
The drug use question seems to have been covered pretty well, so any input there will simply be overkill. However, this kind of statement really irks me:
What I wrote earlier may need to be clarified for those close minded.
What you wrote needed to be clarified for EVERYONE. From the way it was worded, YOU gave the impression that you were pretty much a "regular" marijuana user, with statements like "I used to smoke Pot." and "I started/I quit." This does not give the impression of a couple of instances or "mistakes," but regular use. If you're going to lay out statements like that, you should be prepared for people's reactions. Don't come here looking for advice, paint an obscured picture, then insult everyone when you don't get the feedback you want - because the bottom line is that EVERYONE was reacting to what YOU said - it has nothing to do with people being "close-minded.".
Next time, before you label everyone as being something that most of us are not (especially when you are attempting to solicit opinions/advice - that's a GREAT way to get everyone to help you, huh?), perhaps you should lay off the sarcasm/insults and be a bit clearer about what you're asking from the beginning.
Just a thought.
k
K9 Police
04-21-2002, 17:11
"I have a question live_wire, and if it is too personal you don't have to answer. How long have you used MJ and how often? From the SOUND of your post it seems like you have been using it for a long time."
That is the exact reason Krellum why I posted the above after I read his post. I hope you realize live-wire that at least when I read your post it SEEMED like you were getting high every single day. Perhaps you should re-read your post or have someone else read it to make sure you are portraying the correct point of view you wish to give.
K9
It SEEMS to me that these drug use questions usually end this way. After the writer poses his/her scenario and is roundly criticized by the group, they stage a strategic retreat, claiming their own words SEEMED to say something else.
It's a waste of everyone's time.
Well said both DMclark and K9!!!
toolman23
04-22-2002, 14:59
I dont want to sound like Iam tooting my own horn here but I read all of the posts and wanted to add something if I could.
I graduated from college last May, and recently took a job with USIS doing background checks for the federal government.When I sat down with my BI there was a lengthy discussion about drug use,and it surprised me.
It surprised me because I have done mrijuana twice,once in high school and once my freshman year of college.Thats it,never considered it again. I had to give the names of who I was with,the circumstances,the reasons,everything.
I was also surprised when he asked me, "Do you think you will ever do marijuana again?"This was only a few minutes after I was lectured on how my position would put me in touch with lots of sensitive materials,etc.
The reason I make this point is simple,WHY would you ever consider doing marijuana when you have a job like this?? From what I read on this website,jobs in LE/EMS work are not easy to get.And when someone is fortunate enough to be chosen,they go and do drugs,risking losing a job so many would love to have.
Live-wire,what if you had been partaking in a little clam bake one evening when your pager goes off,the local shopping mall is burning like a mother fu***r and you are needed ASAP.What then??
I guess my point is that it would be not just my hope but everyone in a community that those who protect us,police,fire,EMS,would have enough sense to know that anything can happen at any time,day or night and that your first duty is to do your job,not impair your ability to do so.
Just some ramblings that as I re-read it I know werent well put together,but just my unorganized thoughts.
If anyone can make sense of it,good work.
This guy is a volunteer firefighter/emt not paid. In NJ they have very few paid positions and you would never leave if you had one because they pay better then police jobs. Real fireman are drug tested in NJ.
For what it's worth, I think you guys scared him away.
Sigy:destroy:
I don't want to sound like a cynical jerk, but I'm in a funny mood today.
Its only been 4 months since you last smoked up?
Sheesh, wait two years and then call us.
If you got stopped by the police today, and with what you've told us? Could they find weed in your car if they searched?
And where areyou working that doesn't do random drug testing? You should have been nailed forever ago.
Again, I'm in a mood,
Jay
You know, this guys post brings integrity and ethics into view.
I don't trust him one bit.
Now, not to toot my own horn, but I'm big into ethics and integrity. Last night I went with a few friends to a mexican restaurant really quick to get something to eat, it wasn't some big going out party deal. I never drink but I had the urge to get a margarita. Well, one of the girls that went with us had gotten a DUI in the past and it occurred to me that if I drank only ONE margarita and she saw me drive, she might think I was a hyprocrit and wonder what makes me above the law. So I didn't get a margarita, I got tea instead. I thought about it and I figure this, I represent the whole department I work for and every cop is this whole world, and If I did this one hypocritical thing and drove after drinking, no matter if I was too drunk to drive or not, she would see it and wonder.
Everyone knows cops are held high up on a pedastal above everyone else.
So livewire, if you are still reading this, think about all that.
BBradley
04-28-2002, 15:59
You want to see scared? I'd like to see Live Wire trot on up to the New Jersey State Police recruiters with his present "nothing wrong with MJ" attitude...
Drugs, hard or soft, are illegal. You made a conscious choice to smoke an illegal substance despite the fact that you obviously considered law enforcement as a future career? What if you had stumbled across some crack? There is NO difference. The reasons outlined on this post regarding your situation are among the most relevant and mature that I have ever read. If you cannot accept genuine, correct advice from the vast resources repesented on this post, you have no business being a cop.
copsridealong
06-18-2002, 14:37
:idea: The question here is not one of whether or not someone should smoke pot or if drinking alcohol is worse than drugs. Who cares!! The law is the law. What is the issue here is whether one should lie in order to get the job. In my opinion, experimentation is one thing. But when someone says, "Pot was all I ever did", as did live_wire , well we are then dealing with a different beast. We all make mistakes. Sometimes we can remedy them, but many times we must live with those mistakes. If you want to lie in order to get in, well go ahead. But remember, lies are like little demons just waiting to grow up into big demons. You can rationalize the smoking all you want, but will never be able to honestly say it was never a problem with you.
You are probably a great EMT/Firefighter . There are those out there who would lie about a knee problem in order to get a job as a Fireman...but would you trust your life with that person if he had to run up 20 flights of stairs in order to give you backup?? Probably not.
It's a bit different than smoking weed, but it's still the same sort of thing. If we begin to tell lies in order to accommodate our pasts, well then, where are we willing to draw the line??
If you apply with any LE agencies, then you risk the chance of smearing your package with dis-honesty (that is if you fail a Poly or decide to tell the wrong person your secret over drinks or a soda). Stick with the job you have now. There are probably hundreds of people out there that wish they could do what you do now.
Good luck and stay safe,
CopsRidealong
:cool:
policejob
07-30-2002, 13:53
Look closely at livewire. He is potentially going to be the .00001% of law enforcement that makes his own laws and in turn makes the rest of law enforcement look bad.
Livewire, you will never get it and for all of us (people already in law enforcement) I hope that I never have to explain to some citizen why I should be trusted after he sees you on the news, being arrested for some crime you committed.
I dont care too much about your firefighting career. The one thing I do know is that you cannot commit any crime in law enforcement (on-duty or off-duty) no matter how legal you think it should be.
What is really scary is that you said how you had found some MJ so you smoked it. I have real worries of what you would do when your alone searching someone or something and find more MJ. After all I guess it should be legal and well,,,,,,the dirtbags have plenty to go around,right??
dwolfe11
09-16-2002, 12:19
You know who really makes LE look bad is the people who just lie about thier prior drug use. They are the ones with no honor. I think they are the ones who probably end up making thier own laws up. At least people who admit what they have done have a sense of right and wrong. Lets be honest, would you rather work next to a guy who knows right from wrong or a guy who can look you in the eye and lie. I can see how LE gets a bad name, because you guys weed out all the honest people. If you doubt me then take an honest look at the drug usage among teens statistics.
Just my 2-cents - still 98 cents short for a cup of coffee:D
Well, dwolfe 11, we try to do better than just asking. Generally, we polygraph, do drug screening and a background investigation. Sometimes these are very well done, sometimes not, but most folks who lie are probably turned up and not hired. We too prefer the honest ones who admit use within the policies we have and we don't make a fuss about it. Thing is we get more excellent applicants than we have slots for within those policies and heck, while our "name" could always be better, cop is still better than doper almost everywhere we go.
Dwolfe, I sense a bit of frustration there. Understandable. Sometimes I look around at some of these testing functions and I am sure there are more than a couple guys who will lie about this stuff to get a job. So I tell myself that ain't the way to do this, even if it does work sometimes. I'll get a job eventually, and I'll get it the right way. Screw those guys. Still, they end up with the job I could have gotten if they had been honest. Really disheartening. Hang in there!
dwolfe11
09-19-2002, 02:27
It really makes me mad that according to some agencies, if I smoked pot 20 times as teen 16 years ago I'm not the kind of person who would do a good job. Never mind that I'm a veteran, that I worked a full time job for four years while I went to school, had a 3.72 GPA, managed to get a brown belt in Ju-Jitsu, and have over six years experience as a manager. :eek: But I smoked pot 16 years ago when I was a teen, so I must be a real law breaking slacker who could never contribute anything to their organizations. So I'm not really frustrated, just outraged.
Sorry for the hostile tone:D :D
.......and still 98 cents short for that cup of coffee
KYEMT325
09-19-2002, 13:33
Most agencies are going lax on their rules as far as drug usage goes, particularly a menial drug such as pot. I don't think I'm alone in saying that if the only drug out there was pot...our job would be a lot easier and the only thing wrong with the world would be a shortage of potato chips :D
However, I do agree with you dwolfe, what you did as a 16 year old 16 years ago obviously had no bearing on what kind of person you are today, and should not be held against you in getting a LE job. Now if you smoked crack for a year or something like that, I would look at it differently.
There's a background detective in my agency that is a really goody two-shoes kinda person, never did anything wrong...but if you admit to her that you ever did any kind of drug at any time in your life, she will disqualify you from the process...even though our policy says you can have done something a particular number of times. I think that you may be a little smarter because you tried pot, which could've taken you down the wrong road in life...but obviously turned out to be pretty productive.
dwolfe 11, OK, you're outraged and I'm not entirely unsympathetic. This issue is problematic and does shift from time to time. While increasingly standardizing in the Feds, there are still differences from agency to agency and very different among local and State agencies, all of whom offer rewarding public service careers.
Clearly, some level of mj experimentation is accepted by us. At least accepted to the extent it is not an automatic DQ. It will still be evaluated in comparison to applicants considered for the same position. My agency is 10X. So at some level we have accepted some mj possession and use as "different" than other crimes. We are unlikely to accept 10 speeding tickets, 10 counts of breaking into a coin box, 10 assaults as result of school yard fights or any number of youthful relatively "minor" kinds of offenses.
Factually, I have been involved in meeting and/or interviewing hundreds of applicants and have been involved in reviewing and selection of even more. Most common answer to previous drug use these days? None. Where use is admitted with mj, 5x or less.
See by other posts of yours that you are no fan of the poly, but the practical use is more effective than the theoretical "beat the machine" garbage out there. You can beat a bad operator, if "inconclusive" is good enough, but inconclusive will get you passed over. So will a notation that the candidate used the following "evasive" techniques. We read too. My point is not that the poly is the be all and end all, but it is helpful along with a bi. In the Fed the BI is more than a review of the application. They are done to determine suitability for a Top Secret or higher clearence, so they're pretty agressive.
Here's where I am less sympathetic. You did it. Presumably in each instance you enjoyed it and knew it was illegal. Having chosen to do it, you are outraged that the consequences of having done it, while flexible, are not in all incidence flexible enough to cover you.
None of this makes you anything now but a fine, achieving, person who is considering competition with other fine, achieving citizens who to the extent they partook in fun and illegal activity did so to a measurably lesser degree or not at all. We have to make decisions about hiring people where we have the highest possible basis to determine that they can be entrusted with the life and safety of others and with information that if revealed could threaten the safety and security of the country. And all those decisions are relative ones. Fortunately, we have tons of candidates who have all of the good things and none or few of the questionable and no one, including me, has ever been so exceptional that we felt we weren't getting good enough candidates through the process.
20x at 16 was too much, not because we are moral absolutists about youthful mj use, but because we could fill all our slots 3 times over with people as good or better than we have now without going there. Here's the hard cheese, the process of hiring people is to ensure you are getting the best candidates by culling people for often relatively minor issues. We don't have to understand you until we hire you; couldn't anyway- have to process thousands to get a few hundred.
Lastly, if you are outraged at the consequence of actions you willing took, I understand people grow up. But I am more sympathetic to those with bad interview skills, poor eyesight or exercise induced asthma or crappy traffic records. We ain't pickin' on drugs a whole lot more than we are picking on some things that are not even in the applicant's control.
dwolfe11
09-20-2002, 01:43
I agree about the mj use, I did it. I wish I never had, but I did. I just wonder how many people who work in LE just lie about it. I don't think I could pass a polygraph while telling the truth, but I know that there are people who just have no sense of right or wrong and no sense of guilt like me. It just bothers me that those kinds of people have an advantage in the process for some jobs. I know I just can't lie like that, and I wouldn't interview well because of guilt about my drug use.
But hey who said life was fair anyway?
:D
I used to work in a casino, it always amazed me at how dishonest and heartless people can really be.:(
No comfort, but I'm sure some do. Harder in the Fed, where the poly and BI are solidly done (but we know not perfectly) Probably less sociopaths, we psych them too and then watch them under stress. Have to believe you saw everything sad in a casino that a cop sees on the street.
BBradley
10-06-2002, 02:41
It seems livewire held his breath too long - he seems to have expired. Or did he take too long a drag on that joint?
IBWHEELIN
10-20-2002, 03:15
Live_Wire,
Ok I just need clarification here. You postedOriginally posted by live_wire
. I asked a question to clarify a discision for the future as whether or not to be honest and possibly taint the job of another, or lie and not be found. You have fare more boozers that are on the job, than MJ users. A person who smoke a few puffs on his own time, off duty is now considered a criminal. for now you are the worst criminal.hhhhhhmmmmmmmmmmmm
To start with I would hope to God that no dept. would hire you based on your logic here (hell I wonder how you got the job you have now with this logic) but anyways, You wanted to clarify whether or not to be HONEST? Um, yeah next one, boozers vs MJ users, which one is legal and which one isn't, not that I;m condoning the use of excessive alcohol here or anything. And finally YES, if a person takes a few puffs of MJ he or she is considered a criminal! I think that is it now goodnight.
There is no logic to the alcohol/drugs analogy and no one said it clearer than that cubicle warrior Dilbert last week. Asked by his boss "If we can put a man on the moon why can't we build a computer out of recycled paper?" , Dilbert responds all that proves is that other people can do something different.
The flaw in the analogy of alcohol and drugs is the flaw in the user of drugs. Implicit in their argument of a link is a view that all substances which can produce intoxication must always be used to the extent that they produce intoxication and intoxication is an ok state of being. Wrong, two dogs. People sloshed on alcohol and high on drugs are the only point at which use of the two come together, and a record of both will DQ you.
Use drugs or be a drunk on the job and you will find the bifurcated system we use in law enforcement, we will send you to competent medical or psychological help to get straight and we will fire you for what you did while intoxicated.
Boil down all this alcohol/drug argument and what is left for me is that the drug user is saying I'm no worse than a drunk. OK, point granted.
Negotiate This
10-21-2002, 21:50
To live_wire: I am not currently in the law enforcement field, but I have applied to several departments. I also know several people who have been hired, and several others who are also applying.
I should also note that I have tried marijuana once and have disclosed it to any and all agencies I have applied to.
Here are my observations:
1) Like many others have stated, you do not presently qualify for a local or state law enforcement position, based on your marijuana usage. That is, of course, assuming you tell the truth on applications about your usage. Based on the experiences of aspring LEO acquaintances, I would say your chances of being "found out" in background are about 50-50 if you choose not to disclose the information. I don't recommend that, though.
2) Almost all LE agencies (especially federal) consider marijuana "recidivism" after a long period of abstinence, or experimentation with marijuana after age 22, to be highly unusual. Incidences such as these are likely to raise even more questions about your suitability for a LEO position. It will most certainly disqualify you from any position requiring a federal security clearance.
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