What stuff for off-duty carry?

[williamssd]

Well, I've been on my own now for three weeks. So far I love the work. A bit overwhelming (like now with seven different reports going at once), but I'm happy to go every day.

At my department, we had to finish FTO before the department armorer would allow us to carry off-duty. I've heard the pluses and minuses of doing so (with some nearly foaming at the mouth that I should every time I leave the house). I do now only about 50% of the time, because I have to carry my issued Glock 22. I haven't gotten my Glock 27 yet (personal purchase) but that is what I intend to carry off-duty in the future.

My big question is, do any of your carry other "tools of the trade" off-duty other than a firearm? I was thinking spare magazine (for the G27) and a small container of OC in my pocket. I've even gotten recommendations to gear up like a detective and carry a small flashlight, cuffs, OC, spare magazine, etc. That seems a little much.

The one thing that I try to religiously carry with me now is my cell phone. I have the dispatch numbers programmed, along with LT's office and cell phone, for those rare times when I would have to report something. I certainly follow to the "Better witness vs. Dead hero" philosophy.

Here's what I'm thinking (feel free to critique):

-- Glock 27 (Glock 22 for now)
-- Spare Magazine (for 27)
-- Mk 8 O.C.
-- Cellular phone

Thanks for everyone's advice, and stay safe.

- Steve

[Kahuna5150]

Hi William... You'll notice your second post is missing... I'm sure you'll know why (ala this forum).

Let me first congratulate you on getting through your FTO program. As for carrying off-duty. Short of a department policy requiring or restricting it, I would say it is a personal choice for each officer/agent/individual. Personally I don't think (especially with the Glock 27 available to you soon) there is any reason why you shouldn't carry off-duty at all times. Obviously if you're going to go out drinking or swimming or doing some other related activity the gun should be left at home, but for normal day to day living I say bring it. (Hope I'm not foaming at the mouth too much) :)

My advice would be to carry your weaon in a good holster or other secure method (fanny pack, etc). I would also suggest always carrying a spare magazine regardless of what gun you carry. Although the Glock 22 has 15+1 rounds of .40 caliber, it never hurts to have a spare mag for either reloads (in the event you really end up going to guns off-duty) or to clear malfunctions or other mag related problems with the gun. "Tap rack go", "Drop the mag, slap a fresh one in". etc. etc.

Unlikely you'd need a spare mag, but for the small amount of weight and easy concealment, why carry it. One of those things that when you really need it, you'd carry a 100lb safe on your back with 1 mag in it just to have it.

I would certainly carry my ID and badge off duty. You may even consider a neck chain for your badge so you can quickly display it on your chest if need be. Hate to have a fellow officer or other LEO from another department shoot you because you have just become the "man with a gun".

I would also carry a set of cuffs. Normal would be best, but you could probably get away with flex-cuffs or some other disposable brand in a pinch. You're not going to want to draw down on someone and not have the tools to take them into custody if need be. Obviously holding someone at gun point for the on-duty guys to show up would be what most say to do, but you never know how long you may need to wait, or if you have to cuff someone for some reason (say you don't draw and only need to arrest for something, etc).

OC and a flashlight are perks and would be a plus if you can carry them without a lot of hassel. I would imagine you'll have more use for OC and a flashlight off-duty than a gun, but again it's up to you. One other thing you may want to consider since you didn't mention it. I personally carry two wallets. One has my personal stuff in it (money, credit cards, etc) and the other is strictly my LEO id and badge. When I use my wallet to get money or pay for something, no-one will *EVER* see my badge or ID by mistake. Also if you get robbed someday or someone demands your wallet (getting the drop on you with their weapon). You're going to want to hand them a regular wallet that does not indicate your job.

Just some thoughts.

Congrats and good luck!

Kahuna



*PS* Cellphone is *PERFECT* always carry that equip with you no matter what!

[Celtic Warrior]

William,
Again Congratulations!!! I might sound like one of those foaming at the mouth types, but I personally never leave the house without a pistol (usually 2) (I have some reasons - believe it or not, not everybody finds me warm & cuddly!!!)

I also carry 2 wallets and a cell phone (State issued and pre programmed) (for the same reasoning)

[nsedet]

If you decide to carry off-duty, then at a minimum you also want at least one spare magazine, cuffs, your ID and badge in one wallet, preferably a second badge clipped on your belt next to your gun, and a second wallet with your non-LE stuff (d.l., credit cards, cash, etc.).

The spare magazine is a must for this reason: most weapon failures are the result of a problem with the magazine. If you do not have a back-up gun, you should at least have a second mag that you can use if your first one fails for some reason.

Cuffs are a necessity any time you are armed. You are carrying a weapon because you are a cop, and because you may be required to take enforcement action to save a life, etc. Aside from actually needing them, not carrying cuffs could create a very bad perception after the fact (in court) should you be forced to use deadly force.

[williamssd]

Everyone, thanks very, VERY much for the advice and info.

Nsedet, I pretty convinced on the spare magazine, but haven't heard of anyone wearing the badge on the belt off-duty. I have my wallet badge, but a few coworkers have stated that wearing the badge on the belt draws too much (and most likely unwanted) attention. What reasons are there for wearing it on the belt? (I do have the belt clip thing for it for those rare times when I'm plain-clothes.)

Also, are the Fobus holsters/accessories made of Kydex? I was thinking of the Fobus line of gear to use, but I've gotten a few recommendations for Kydex-type holsters. Any preferences/opinions?

Thanks again.

- Steve

[Kahuna5150]

Originally posted by williamssd
haven't heard of anyone wearing the badge on the belt off-duty. a few coworkers have stated that wearing the badge on the belt draws too much (and most likely unwanted) attention.


Well off-duty you are going to be carrying a weapon *CONCEALED*. So to have your badge clipped next to your holster would also mean you badge is concealed as well. The purpose of having a badge displayed next to your holster on your belt is so that in the event you accidentally show your weapon, (cover shirt, jacket, whatever is lifted or opened somehow) anyone seeing the gun will also see the badge.

It is also very difficult to ID yourself when you have drawn down on a suspect off-duty. You aren't going to be holding your wallet out in front of you with your ID and Badge showing (more than likely). On the belt is good, because you can at least be displaying a badge once you've exposed your weapon or drawn down on someone. The neck chain holder is also a good idea since it puts your badge hanging down into the 5x or 10x area of your body (5x or 10x being the heart/shot area of your body that most range targets desisgnate as the center of your chest).

Nost sure what Fobus is made of (could be Kydex, but I don't think it is for some reason). When you hear Kydex, and people talking about holsters, they are usually praising the quality of Sidearmor holsters. I don't own one myself (I have the Fobus), but they look like nice holsters, just a bit more money! :)

Kahuna

[nsedet]

Originally posted by williamssd
Also, are the Fobus holsters/accessories made of Kydex? I was thinking of the Fobus line of gear to use, but I've gotten a few recommendations for Kydex-type holsters. Any preferences/opinions?


Fobus makes a very nice holster, one I carried for about two years. However, when I transferred agencies, I ended up with an Uncle Mike's kydex holster, and found it to be a better holster overall. It is more adjustable than the Fobus holsters, and is easier to draw from when concealed (doesn't snag on clothes as much as the Fobus holster).

[nsedet]

Originally posted by williamssd
What reasons are there for wearing it on the belt? (I do have the belt clip thing for it for those rare times when I'm plain-clothes.)

Steve,
Kahuna addressed this very well. Quick story: former coworker of mine, as a new agent, was off-duty and shopping at an area mall, reached for his wallet, and ended up exposing his gun, which was on his hip in a holster, no badge visible. The clerk ended up calling the police about a man with a gun, and shortly thereafter this agent was on the wrong end of a felony traffic stop; while there was no issue once he was ID'd, this would have been avoided had he had a badge next to the gun so the clerk would have known he was a cop.

[Erik]

Some good advice.

However...

Cuffs aren't necessary per se. But, it is your waistline, after all.

Don't assume that the only reason you'll need a concealed pistol is to carry out an off-duty LEO action; saving the day, making an arrest, etc. After all, you might just need it in the sence that most carriers do; to defend yourself or a loved one.

Do not become a lazy LEO carrier and rely on your badge clipped next to your holster to get you out of a jam. Better to familiarize yourself with carrying concepts and practice until you get it right every time than to pick up bad habits. (Lazy LEO carriers is a pet peeve of mine.)


That said, I'll reiterate the need for a quality carry rig; belt, holster, magpuoch, or variation depending on your chosen method.

Best of luck to you.