Inspector Off Duty

[ssween2]

I know that the only weapon that USCS Inspectors are allowed to carry off duty is the Glock 17. However the issued credentials only say that the holder is authorized to carry firearms, and I believe that to buy a gun all they need is their creds.....no CCW permit. I hear stories of inspectors carrying other weapons off duty other than the Glock 17 on their creds without a CCW permit. Is this accepted? The attitude of some is, "My creds say I can carry so thats that". Any opinions or comments on this? If you get into a jam and aren't carrying the 17 would Customs hang you out to dry? Thanks

[Kahuna5150]

Hi sween...

Well I would assume that if an inspector’s creds say he/she is authorized to carry a weapon that they are not violating the law by carrying a non-approved weapon off-duty. I mean an inspector isn’t going to be getting arrested by local LEO's simply because he/she is carrying a non-approved weapon off-duty (G-19, G-26, or whatever). Most (including myself) wouldn't know or care what brand and model an inspector carries off-duty. If you are a supervisor with Customs, or INS, or the OIG, then sure you might investigate an inspector who is carrying a non-authorized weapon off duty, but even then I would imagine the investigation would lead to an administrative (IE: termination) outcome and not a criminal one.

Not sure if there are actual statutes in place in the USC that makes it an offense to carry an unauthorized weapon under your fed LE status. I would be surprised if there is. Here in CA if a Fed or *ANY* LEO is authorized to carry a weapon off-duty, no one cares what weapon it is or if it is approved by the authorizing agency. If I see an Inspector with a gun other than the G-17 off duty, I don't care. Hard enough to keep track of an enforce all the laws and follow all the case decisions without having the desire to take on the administrative rules and regulations inspections/enforcements for some other agencies operations manual.

Kahuna

[ssween2]

Kahuna,
Thanks for the reply. Im starting FLETC on Jan 7th with USCS as a CEO. I was hoping that I would be able to carry a weapon other than the 17 off duty due to its size, but im not going to risk termination or disciplinary action. Like you said im sure most LEO's wouldnt try and jam me up, but if its not cool with customs than I guess its not cool for me! I would like to find out if its really that big of a deal with USCS. Its a shame we arent given the option of carrying another weapon off duty. Thanks brother.

[nsedet]

You would not have a problem under state law, or under Federal law, but you would (probably) have a problem with your agency. I doubt anyone would go out to look into this type of administrative violation (you never know, but I doubt Customs IA has that much free time). The problem is, if you are carrying a weapon in case something happens, then carrying the wrong weapon will probably get you jammed up when something does happen. It's an unfortunate policy, but could be a serious issue for you if you are involved in an incident...even if you were involved in a righteous shooting, you may find yourself out of a job, and--as or more importantly--without Government representation. By carrying an unauthorized weapon for which you are not qualified, you run the risk that you will be seen as being outside the scope of your duties, which is a bad thing. Of course, you run that risk anytime you take enforcement action, and politics and publicity do play a part in the decision-making process.

[Kahuna5150]

Originally posted by ssween2
I was hoping that I would be able to carry a weapon other than the 17 off duty due to its size, but im not going to risk termination or disciplinary action.

I agree with you 100%. With the Glocks in particular the guns (17, 19, 26) are identical with the exception of size. If you know how to use a 17 including stripping and cleaning, then you already know how to do the same with the 19 and 26 (and all glocks for that matter). It is rather silly that an agency that approves any stock 9mm Glock wouldn't approve all other stock 9mm glock models (I know I'm not thinking about liability and department owned guns versus private etc). Alas this is the way things are... :)

One other consideration if you would like to be able to carry a smaller, or larger weapons off-duty. Many states are "Shall Issue" CCW states. If you are assigned to one of these states you can certainly apply for and be granted a CCW permit. Then you can carry whatever weapon you want (as is authorized by state law and your CCW permit). Only thing you would want to do if you opt for the CCW route is... I would *NEVER* carry my credentials, badge, or any other item identifying me as a Fed LEO. I would also never identify myself or make any other indications I was a Fed LEO. This goes for carrying as well. If the law says you can't carry in a bar with a CCW, but you can with your Fed LEO status, then I would make sure I don't go in a bar if carrying on my civilian CCW.

I find the 17 is not that hard to conceal or carry. I prefer the sub-compacts, but carry a glock 19 off duty currently.

Congrats on the job!!

Kahuna

[Tuck_TKE]

As Nsedet stated, basically IF it hits the fan and you are carrying an unapproved weapon off duty on your creds, don't expect Government representation, It will be documented what you were shooting and if it makes it to other parties involved that you had an unapproved gun using your Fed LEO creds justifying your right to carry, you would probably get hung out to dry and lose your job. Customs will cover this all in your 24 hour concealed carry course at FLETC, They will go over this in depth, including bringing Chief Counsel and your Firearms instructor in to cover any questions. My personal choice is to carry my personal weapon with my state issued Concealed Carry Permit. A G-17 isn't a lot of fun to hide, especially when the temps are up and you're required to also use the 6 approved off duty holsters Customs limits you too. On my state permit, I can carry any gun and holster I am comfortable with. Like I said, This WILL be covered at FLETC in detail.

[ssween2]

Thanks guys