Thread: FCIA/FLEOA thoughts . . .

Not sure if this is the best location for this particular question, but I figured "stabbing in the dark" has been relatively effective for some assailants, so it can't hurt to try it here. . . .

At any rate, I've got dues coming up and recent research through the current and archived threads seem to indicate only one 2007 posting on FLEOA issues and trends with the rest dating back to 2005 and preceding.

So, seeing how they've sent me my third notice now and I've been a little too tied up at work to research current trends and politicized leanings before I anty-up another year, I'd like to get any updated input from those-in-the-know on the FCIA and FLEOA memberships.

I am -- intentionally -- not posting who I have been a member with in order to garner as many well-rounded observations and suggestions apart from the usual: "I can't believe you pay up hard earned money to _(pick one)_!" As such, history lessons on either or both are likely not the focus (for me, maybe others), with "current" being the operative word with both association's trends, issues, and directions (including likes and dislikes).

Thanks in advance.

Originally Posted by 65595

Not sure if this is the best location for this particular question, but I figured "stabbing in the dark" has been relatively effective for some assailants, so it can't hurt to try it here. . . .

At any rate, I've got dues coming up and recent research through the current and archived threads seem to indicate only one 2007 posting on FLEOA issues and trends with the rest dating back to 2005 and preceding.

So, seeing how they've sent me my third notice now and I've been a little too tied up at work to research current trends and politicized leanings before I anty-up another year, I'd like to get any updated input from those-in-the-know on the FCIA and FLEOA memberships.

I am -- intentionally -- not posting who I have been a member with in order to garner as many well-rounded observations and suggestions apart from the usual: "I can't believe you pay up hard earned money to _(pick one)_!" As such, history lessons on either or both are likely not the focus (for me, maybe others), with "current" being the operative word with both association's trends, issues, and directions (including likes and dislikes).

Thanks in advance.

We formed FLEOA in the late 70's because FCIA was not responsive to the needs of 1811's. The initial cohort of FLEOA were former FCIA members, including Jack Solerwitz, who was our attorney in FCIA, and accomplished much for us before his fall.

Still can't figure why it hangs on.

Originally Posted by 65595

Not sure if this is the best location for this particular question, but I figured "stabbing in the dark" has been relatively effective for some assailants, so it can't hurt to try it here. . . .

At any rate, I've got dues coming up and recent research through the current and archived threads seem to indicate only one 2007 posting on FLEOA issues and trends with the rest dating back to 2005 and preceding.

So, seeing how they've sent me my third notice now and I've been a little too tied up at work to research current trends and politicized leanings before I anty-up another year, I'd like to get any updated input from those-in-the-know on the FCIA and FLEOA memberships.

I am -- intentionally -- not posting who I have been a member with in order to garner as many well-rounded observations and suggestions apart from the usual: "I can't believe you pay up hard earned money to _(pick one)_!" As such, history lessons on either or both are likely not the focus (for me, maybe others), with "current" being the operative word with both association's trends, issues, and directions (including likes and dislikes).

Thanks in advance.

Long story short, do 1 thru 3 below.

1. Join FLEOA, before any of the below.
2. Get Professional Liability Insurance
3. Join local state FOP or state peace officers organization if they protect feds (many do).

Ramos and Compeon (BP El Paso case) had to go out of pocket to hire attorneys, I think they ones they hired was a will/estate attorney and another one was a low level criminal defense attorney.

We all know how that case played out.

Again, see #1-3 above..you can never have enough attorneys

I disagree with Satpak77 only to this extent. It is entirely possible to have too many payments for coverage that ultimately is going to result in you having one attorney representing you. Need to think through the issues you might expect to need help with (disciplinary actions, civil liability, criminal charges) and plan through what kind of help/lawyer you would expect to need. Through a representative organization you might get a good lawyer for disciplinary issues, including post shooting interviews. Get into civil liability or criminal may want to shop a bit more and have proper legal liability coverage.

good points, but this is something I observed occur on the job, a real incident. The guy involved I know personally.

1. Agent ABC is in a shooting
2. FLEOA handled the "admin side" of things, OPR, etc
3. He hired local "top gun" criminal defense attorney to handle local prosecution, out of pocket, I think via home equity loan. (he came out clean, no problems....). As an aside, shooting occurred in liberal, non LE friendly community.
4. FLEOA and local attorney coordinated things amongst themselves
5. No criminal charges, no admin sanctions

Observation: Local FOP/PORAC/etc type plan could have provided a attorney to handle the "criminal side" of things but he was not a member

I've heard good and bad things about FLEOA's legal representation. I haven't heard anything about FCIA, they are a much smaller organization. I joined FOP and pay for their legal plan which seems very good, you get to pick from a list of lawyers and they represent you in civil, administrative and criminal up to a certain dollar amount. I also am a member of FLEOA. I've heard more negative than positives about FLEOA's legal assistance, I've never had to use it and hope never to use it.

It looks like FCIA hasn't updated their web-page since 2005. That should tell you something about their attention to detail.

Originally Posted by Grudd

I've heard good and bad things about FLEOA's legal representation. I haven't heard anything about FCIA, they are a much smaller organization. I joined FOP and pay for their legal plan which seems very good, you get to pick from a list of lawyers and they represent you in civil, administrative and criminal up to a certain dollar amount. I also am a member of FLEOA. I've heard more negative than positives about FLEOA's legal assistance, I've never had to use it and hope never to use it.

I have used their legal services for some stuff, nothing hostile or criminal, just some guidance on OPM related rules. They were good. However, there are XXX number of FLEOA attorneys for XXXX thousands of 1811s in the world. They are handling EEO issues, shootings, grievances, etc etc, so they are quite busy at any given time. I will say that when legal documents arrive at your agency's Chief Counsel with the FLEOA letterhead, they do take notice.

FLEOA has amongst its membership SACs and ASACs, so FLEOA will never aggresively "go after" your agency if they are trying to "do you" on something (season vets know what I mean...). FLEOA walks a balancing act sometimes.

With that said, if I was in a serious criminal matter, I would want a local criminal defense attorney, who knows the prosecutors, knows the judge, etc (hey, this is how it works folks), etc.

100% of criminal prosecutions have room for "prosecutorial discretion" and the best way to tap that is a well known local criminal defense attorney, who knows everybody and can influence things. It can also mean the difference of a "sales job" to a Grand Jury or a simple "gotta put it in front of" the Grand Jury. A good local attorney or one from the big city nearby can influence this.

Guys who have been there know what I mean.