Thread: FBI SA Issued Holster

I know I might be getting ahead of myself, but I was curiuos about some the "gear" we get issued at the Q. what make/model holster do we get issued? do they issue handcuffs, oc spray, etc? do most agents carry all these things every day? I've seen several agents in my local field office who didn't even appear armed. Just curious.

Ryan

PR,

At QT you are issued a standard paddle holster that fits Glock 22. Nothing fancy but gets the job done. You also get all the other accompanying accessories.

As far as wearing it all. you can easily pick out the newer agents becuase they are wearing everything multiple magazines/batons/oc/two pair of cuffs/vest under their suits while in office....... After awhile, and after you realize your line of work(squad assignment, i.e. applicant, healthcare, etc.) doesnt necessarily require one to be armed with multiple magazines, etc.... plus all the other stuff, you tend to shed it. OFCOURSE if you are going on a raid or arrest, etc, you will carry everyting. I am talking about day to day office stuff. You end up buying a G27 and carrying that around instead on your ankle and leave the other stuff in the car for when its necessary.

Dont worry QT will provide you with more than what you will ever use or wear.

take care

Originally Posted by .40cal

PR,

As far as wearing it all. you can easily pick out the newer agents becuase they are wearing everything multiple magazines/batons/oc/two pair of cuffs/vest under their suits while in office....... After awhile, and after you realize your line of work(squad assignment, i.e. applicant, healthcare, etc.) doesnt necessarily require one to be armed with multiple magazines, etc.... plus all the other stuff, you tend to shed it. OFCOURSE if you are going on a raid or arrest, etc, you will carry everyting. I am talking about day to day office stuff. You end up buying a G27 and carrying that around instead on your ankle and leave the other stuff in the car for when its necessary.

This is the absolute truth.....most senior agents don't go armed, heavily, in the office.....you would be surprised how many that you don't think are armed, really are....bottom line, you wear what the circumstances dictate....but two pairs of handcuffs, three mags, a baton and weapon, while sitting at your desk, on one of ten floors in a building that guards cover is probably excessive....the same in a RA might be different. IT is the proverbial "It depends"

Good luck

Originally Posted by Time Traveller

This is the absolute truth.....most senior agents don't go armed, heavily, in the office.....you would be surprised how many that you don't think are armed, really are....bottom line, you wear what the circumstances dictate....but two pairs of handcuffs, three mags, a baton and weapon, while sitting at your desk, on one of ten floors in a building that guards cover is probably excessive....the same in a RA might be different. IT is the proverbial "It depends"

Good luck

SAs Martha Dixon Martinez and Michael John Miller.

"On November 22, 1994, Special Agents Martha Dixon Martinez and Michael John Miller, as well as a Washington, D.C., police detective, were shot and killed inside the District's police headquarters building. At approximately 3:30 p.m., gunman Bennie Lee Lawson entered the "cold case" squad room, to which the Agents were assigned, and opened fire with a TEC-9 assault weapon. During the exchange of fire, a third Special Agent was shot and seriously wounded, and a 15-year-old boy was shot in the leg. Lawson, who also died of gunshot wounds sustained during the incident, had left handwritten notes at his home indicating that his intended targets were the commander of the police department's homicide squad and his investigators. Lawson was a suspect in a triple homicide, which occurred a month prior, and he had been questioned by D.C. homicide detectives the previous week." - www.fbi.gov

SA John L. Bailey

"On June 25, 1990, Special Agent John L. Bailey was fatally wounded during an attempted robbery of a Las Vegas, Nevada, bank. SA Bailey, who was serving a subpoena in the bank, heard a teller scream. The teller told SA Bailey that the man who had just left her window had a gun and attempted to rob her. SA Bailey drew his weapon, identified himself as an FBI Agent, and ordered the bank robber to stop. As the man turned with a gun in his hand, SA Bailey fired one shot, which struck the front glass door. The robber dropped his gun. SA Bailey frisked the robber and placed him on a chair. However, SA Bailey's attention was apparently diverted and the bank robber lunged at SA Bailey, knocking the Agent's gun out of his hand. The bank robber recovered his own weapon and shot SA Bailey three times." -www.fbi.gov

I personally know another agent who walked into a situation at a valet shop near his office and ended up in the middle of a shooting. He was hit in the hip and he took out the subject. Bottom line, you never know when something could happen and if you aren't prepared, bad things can happen.

I agree one should be prepared, however I think the point is that "newbies" are easy to spot in an 1811 slot. No one said to leave the office w/o a firearm, but there are "degrees" of equipment readiness. No biggie, just an office observance.

I can give you stories of fantastic agents in gunfights with a 5 shot Chief using a belt for handcuffs. Also of DEA S/As at Jungle School at Ft. Sherman, carrying every goody sold at Ranger Joes.....which they promptly threw away 3 hours later. Too heavy and little use!

As was already pointed out, 2 pairs of cuffs, ASP and double mag pouches on the 10th floor office DOES draw some looks!

SAs Martha Dixon Martinez and Michael John Miller.

Thanks for the reminder, BuMan. I was living in DC at the time (well...commuting between college in southeastern, VA and my wife's place in DC) when this occurred, and it's an incident that has stuck with me.

No, I don't wear everything that I'm issued in the office, but I do always wear a weapon and a set of cuffs - which a lot of agents do not. Keep in mind that I have always worked in a small office, in a building without security, and often without even a receptionist or waiting area.

I'd also point out that regardless of what type of case you happen to be working, if you're an 1811 and are armed by policy, you should be armed while you're out and about on the job. I don't believe in different levels of readiness in relation to the perceived seriousness of the type of case you're working: if you're not in the Federal Bulding with the "blue coats" guarding the front door, you're prepared, whether you're working on a serial killer investigation or interviewing some grandmother who witnessed a crime. I spent a lot of time working "healthcare" and there's nothing "safe" about interviewing investigative subjects who ripped off gov't health care programs: they're usually the poorest segment of society, living in slums, not-so-nice neighborhoods, housing projects, etc. Most also have lengthy criminal records, histories of drug use, alcoholism, spousal abuse, etc. More often than not, if somoene is involved in one of your cases in some way, there's a reason they're involved (be it by association with an undesirable person, where they live or work, places they've frequented, etc.).

k

I appreciate the above discussion. I am currently on standby with two f.l.e.'s and one local p.d. My brother and I have had this discussion only once (he is a narcotics detective). I asked why he carried every time he left the house and he said "just in case something happens like I see a guy I busted who just got out of the pen for ten years or a pissed off informant... cause you never know". I didn't need to ask twice. I think I will carry while on the job because it's better to be prepared for the worst.

Originally Posted by .40cal

PR,

At QT you are issued a standard paddle holster that fits Glock 22. Nothing fancy but gets the job done. You also get all the other accompanying accessories.

I'm curious as to the brand of holster, and is it usually worn during one's career, or do agents switch to something they perceive as better?
Thanks.

Originally Posted by BuMan

SAs Martha Dixon Martinez and Michael John Miller.

I knew Martha very well and I know her widower as well....I also knew John Bailey....Martha was armed, John made some tactical mistakes...I don't understand your point, BuMan?

Originally Posted by KentuckyBlues

"just in case something happens like I see a guy I busted who just got out of the pen for ten years or a pissed off informant... cause you never know".

I can agree with that. A friend of mine who works as a corrections officer at the county jail was involved in a scuffle with an inmate when he first started working there. A month or two later he ran into that individual on the street (after he had been released), and they both just stared each other down. He says he has no idea what would have happened if the guy would have tried something, all my friend had with him was his trusty little pocket knife. Ever since then he's carried his little glock with him when he's on the town, and I can't blame him for it...

It is better to have a gun and not need it, then to need a gun and not have it. So what if it is uncomfortable. Deal with it. I have worn a gun 7 days a week for at least the last 4 years and I have never had to us it. I hear the same excusses for not wearing one all the time. I remind people that I carry a spare tire in my car yet I have never had a flat. I keep a fire extinguisher in my house although I never had a fire. It comes down to this. You can do everything right and be at the wrong place at the wrong time. I have run into people that I have dealt with on duty that I run into off duty. Some even know where I live. I remind myself that before I go to work that this may be the day I may have to take a life to save my own or someone elses. I take this stuff seriously. We live in a world were good people die all the time and where people want to simply kill you because of the uniform you wear or the country you live in. So if someone wants to laugh at me because I am considered a rookie in their eyes, I can deal with it. The bottom line is this. Do you have the mindset, skills, and tools to do what is necessary when the flag goes up?

Originally Posted by MtnCop

The bottom line is this. Do you have the mindset, skills, and tools to do what is necessary when the flag goes up?

Absolutely

Originally Posted by Time Traveller

I knew Martha very well and I know her widower as well....I also knew John Bailey....Martha was armed, John made some tactical mistakes...I don't understand your point, BuMan?

TT,

I believe the point he was trying to make was that even in a guarded law enforcement building, you may not be as safe as you believe you are. I do not think he intended any disrespect.

Shawn